darkwheeldarkwheelEarly hyperspace technology exceeded 7ly jump ranges, with historical evidence suggesting 2b hyperdrives enabled extended travel in the 3200s. Understanding this technological progression constrains or expands where Raxxla could realistically be located based on when it was discovered and by whom.
Original theorist: Han_Zen -- View original post
Analyzes that Faraway was the first commercial system, not the first hyperspace technology. Marlin Duval's fleet reached Achenar in the 2300s without Faraway system, suggesting Raxxla inhabitants may not be restricted to standard GalCop technology.
Well strictly speaking the Faraway system wasn't the hyperdrive system, it was just the first commercially available system. I think this needs to be treated akin to commercial airflight, with air-traffic control etc. As you say, a misjump could lead to all sorts of complications. From the descriptions in TDW, Faraway seems to be more a method for giving a highly controlled and safe jump route and co-ordinating all the traffic trying to use that route. Click to expand... This is true. Faraway was probably in use, in GalCop space for some period before 3125. At that point, it was no longer in use. As a means to increase safety it was probably useful to Galcop, that only controlled a few sectors(galaxies) with a limited number of systems in each. Hyper space technology is much older t...
Analyzes that humanity has been largely confined to the Bubble for 1000 years despite hyperspace capability. Suggests old hyperdrive was poor/slow with week-long charge times. Dynasty expeditions in 3270s were groundbreaking for distance, and even they struggled.
All this really asks some odd questions about the empty nature of the galaxy given that we've been hyper-space capable for 1000 years and yet apparently never got that far into the galaxy. The old (pre ED lore) faraway network and later 7ly limit really helped to explain why humanity kept to a very small bubble of stars for the last 1000 years. Thatchinho is speculating that we've always had the capability to travel pretty much like we do now, in terms of range, and as you know, in three years we've crossed the galaxy and set up colonies far flung from the bubble, discovered aliens on our doorstep (guardians) that were previously unknown etc. The fact that this is a new thing (we're not doing a TOS era Trek and finding all these "old" human colonies in uncharted space - at all) - that su...
Notes that 2b Hyperdrive in the 3200s enabled characters like Rebecca and Dynasty expeditions to travel significant distances, but this was exceptional technology of that era.
All this really asks some odd questions about the empty nature of the galaxy given that we've been hyper-space capable for 1000 years and yet apparently never got that far into the galaxy. The old (pre ED lore) faraway network and later 7ly limit really helped to explain why humanity kept to a very small bubble of stars for the last 1000 years. Thatchinho is speculating that we've always had the capability to travel pretty much like we do now, in terms of range, and as you know, in three years we've crossed the galaxy and set up colonies far flung from the bubble, discovered aliens on our doorstep (guardians) that were previously unknown etc. The fact that this is a new thing (we're not doing a TOS era Trek and finding all these "old" human colonies in uncharted space - at all) - that su...
FSD was developed ~10 years ago and became widespread 3 years ago. Older FTL was extremely limited, suggesting older bases would be rare. Peregrina was considered a dangerous long-haul trip 50 years ago but isn't far on modern maps.
All of those bases are new - as in, made in the last three years. So, all of them fit into my logic - in that, if FTL was easy and commonplace prior to FSD then those bases would be old and there would be colonies all over the Galaxy. There's not, so, older FTL was limited in the extreme. 2) Sure, but you're forgetting - Raxxla is known about. So, at least one person made it there and back, and if Ryder's theories/myths are true then many people made it there, live there and guard it. If that's the case then it must have been close enough to known space that getting there (and back) was viable - what's the point of guarding a place and assassinating people that know where it is if it's so far away that it's almost impossible to get to? Click to expand... Are they new? They just became...
Proposes testing jump range capability of early Cobra by charting course from Lave to discovered Jameson Cobra crash site. If completable with 7ly jumps, verifies feasibility; if not, disproves 7ly maximum limit. Notes different hyperdrive eras not directly comparable to current Quirium drive.
Ok, so a couple of things here. Jason Ryder didn't find Raxxla, he only found evidence for it's existence. Jump range isn't limited to 7ly jump range. Full post with screenshots below, but in summary, it's been possible to cover ranges greater than 7ly since the very early days of hyperspace: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...-Discussions?p=6159264&viewfull=1#post6159264 Possibly this was done by doing lots of sub 0.5ly jumps, but that doesn't really matter, the principle is still the same. Click to expand... We maybe don't even need to speculate. there's now at least one in-game way to bust whether 7ly was a max limit on a 3125-era cobra. Jameson's Cobra that's just been found - all you need to do is chart a course from Lave to the crash site, if you can't make that with 7ly ...
Proposes early hyperdrives required long recharge times between jumps, necessitating micro-jumps (possibly 0.5ly each) taking hours of calculations via SysCon-like systems. Explains why humanity didn't expand far despite FTL. References Salome/Luko manual jump calculation around Col 70 permit lock as evidence.
I agree. That's one of the reasons I think Raxxla is in the bubble now. There's little evidence whatsoever (even in non-Lore but old "myth" stories from older games) that Humanity got very far outside the bubble prior to the 2b hyperdrive - which was noted specifically for having very long jump ranges compared to what was previously possible - and even then, it wasn't great. I speculate that older Hyperdrives might have needed recharging before jumping again. Essentially you'd need to make a series of micro-jumps to get anywhere, and the recharge might have taken hours - or it might be like Lightspeed in Star Wars, requiring a lot of calculations before making the jump - we know from TDW that was one thing the Faraway Network did (SysCon did the jump calculations). We also know that this ...
Thatchinho proposes using the recently discovered Jameson's Cobra crash site to empirically test whether the 7ly jump range limit was real by charting a course from Lave to the crash site.
We maybe don't even need to speculate. there's now at least one in-game way to bust whether 7ly was a max limit on a 3125-era cobra. Jameson's Cobra that's just been found - all you need to do is chart a course from Lave to the crash site, if you can't make that with 7ly jumps, you know the jump range was definitely more. If you can make it, well you know it's at least plausible that 7ly was the max range for a cobra. Personally I don't think it matters. Ryder's ship didn't use the Quirium drive (or, at the very least, not the later version used in the game), so even if you take 100% of everything in TDW as fact (which is definitely isn't), and even if you take everything in Elite 1 as fact (which it definitely isn't), then the one still doesn't relate to the other, and neither relate to...
Discussion of how Sol-Achenar distance (139.5ly) and colonization timeline (hyperspace early 22nd century, Achenar settled mid-23rd) can be used to estimate early hyperdrive speeds rather than jump ranges.
We maybe don't even need to speculate. there's now at least one in-game way to bust whether 7ly was a max limit on a 3125-era cobra. Jameson's Cobra that's just been found - all you need to do is chart a course from Lave to the crash site, if you can't make that with 7ly jumps, you know the jump range was definitely more. If you can make it, well you know it's at least plausible that 7ly was the max range for a cobra. Personally I don't think it matters. Ryder's ship didn't use the Quirium drive (or, at the very least, not the later version used in the game), so even if you take 100% of everything in TDW as fact (which is definitely isn't), and even if you take everything in Elite 1 as fact (which it definitely isn't), then the one still doesn't relate to the other, and neither relate to...
Louis Calvert analyzes the historical expansion from Sol to Achenar (139.5ly direct), determining probable travel speeds ranged from 2.79-139.5ly per year depending on journey duration, and that unmanned probes scouted Achenar first.
Hmm, do we have a date pinned down for Jameson's strike with the Mycoid Missile? Anyway, while we don't have the jump range of early hyperdrive system's confirmed, in some respects it's not the jump range that's the key thing, it's the distance travellable per unit time that reall. So we know that Sol -> Achenar involves some distances that are between 8.63 and 8.74 ly, but that's not the critical point.(https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...-Discussions?p=6159264&viewfull=1#post6159264). Sol -> Achenar is 139.5 l direct. Hyperspace was discovered in the early 22nd century. Achenar was colonised in the mid 23rd century. In general the expansion following the discovery of hyperspace was unmanned probes followed by manned craft. Achenar was specifically chosen by Duval because it had a...
The region between Sol and Alioth is suggested as probable location for systems with reversed FFE galactic coordinates, potentially relevant to tracking pre-ED lore locations.
The Mycoid vaccine was developed or at least produced on Hotice 1. Hotice does not exist under that name in ED. The vaccine was made by Inter-Gal/Sirius Medical Research, presumably for INRA. I don't know if the vaccine is still lore at all. It's a bit difficult to track the position of systems from the FFE map, because the galactic coordinates were reversed in the old map. I made an explanation in this post: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...-Discoveries?p=6086544&viewfull=1#post6086544 The region between Sol and Alioth is not unlikely, I think. Click to expand... Hi, thanks for clarifying ! But somehow I have in mind that Alioth had something to do with the first Thargoid war, I am quite sure having read something about a hidden base in Alioth system...... maybe someone be so ki...
The Dark Wheel references safe unaccompanied hyperspace jumps up to 0.1 LY being feasible, suggesting Raxxla or evidence for it might exist within 0.1 LY of systems connected to the Faraway network in the Bubble, discoverable through new scanning mechanics.
There is also a line in The Dark Wheel about unaccompanied hyperspace jumps that springs to mind (though it might not be canon) that says something like it being exceptionally dangerous to jump beyond 0.1 LY but that up to that distance it was fairly safe. That often makes me think that Raxxla, or evidence for it, might actually be lurking in the Bubble up to 0.1 LY from one of the systems connected to the Faraway network. If that is the case, this is a clue that might be discoverable with the new scanning mechanics in 3.3. If Raxxla or the evidence for it required a longer hyperspace jump, though, then it could be anywhere - the range of the Galactic Hyperdrives is unknown. Click to expand... ‘Returned from Deep Space...’ - deep space is the in-game name for any in-system space not a s...
Quirium Drives possessed intergalactic range capabilities comparable to modern FSD speed, but modern drives lack the range. This suggests Raxxla, discovered in early exploration days, could be anywhere in the Milky Way despite being found early.
My understanding is that Quirium Drives were capable of intergalactic travel. While modern FSDs are as fast as the old Quirium Drives, they don't have even a fraction of the range. Yet another concern with trying to find Raxxla; while it was first discovered in the early days of exploration, that doesn't really narrow it down beyond FDev's "it's in the Milky Way" comment.
Raxxla or evidence of it must have been discoverable before the early 32nd century, before Faraway jump lanes were established. Original discoverers would have encountered it through methods predating the Faraway network, possibly through Generation Ships or early hyperdrives.
This is a very important point. There are some historical facts that are canon (at least at the time of Drew's lore articles and there was a summary of Hyperdrive tech in Galnet that should still be canon) that are worth mentioning again here: Raxxla was a myth even in the early 32nd Century. Interstellar travel was accomplished in that time by the Faraway jump lanes and riskier hyperdrives (used by some Generation Ships, amongst others). The Faraway network of jump lanes had to be built up through normal space travel - it took centuries to set up. This often leads me to think that Raxxla, or the clues to its existence found by Jason Ryder, had been around and discoverable before the early 32nd Century. The original discoverers of Raxxla would therefore have had to encounter it by one...
Ancient Quirium Drives existed and were capable of extraordinary jumps. This suggests Raxxla may have been reachable via historical technology, implying it could still be within the bubble.
Ok! A few Things: 1). Whats the deal with Lave 2? Every now and again i see it mentioned along with the Raxxla mystery by some CMDRs. As though its somehow connected. Yet i've never found anything that suggests it has anything to do with it. I know that the author of "Lave Revolution" requested Fdev to permit lock the planet for some reason. I read that whole book and found nothing. I've read somewhere else from one CMDR that Lave 2 ether was, is, or replaced Raxxla, according to them. Was Lave 2 connected to the Raxxla mystery in some book i haven't read? 2). When mentioning Raxxla possibly being close to the bubble, there seem to be something that gets continually forgotten: THE QUIRIUM DRIVES EXISTED! http://elite-dangerous.wikia.com/wiki/Hyperdrive#cite_note-:0-2 & https://community....
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